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Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
555
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Posted - 2014.01.17 21:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP must be assuming that all scouts are going to use their 2nd equipment slot for the new cloaking device which is obviously going to have a beastly fitting requirement in order to keep it for the scouts only. This will not happen many people will forgo the cloaking device put a couple compact hives in equipment and use all that CPU/PG the scouts will have to make slayers that assault suits won't be able to compete with.
This is so like the CCP assumption that logi's will use their 1HP armor repair/level so they can survive while repping others that it is absolutely hilarious to me. Giving scouts 2 equipment slots and more PG/CPU across the board will make the slayer logi problem seem trivial in comparison. |
Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
556
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 22:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
So I ran some quick and rough numbers with the Gallente scout because I think it is going to be the most OP scout...
I calculated assuming Level 5 for electronics and engineering, as well as for shield extenders, armor plates, armor reps. Level 5 for shield and armor as well (I am not absolutely sure how the armor and shield bonuses are calculated with regard to including mods or before mods I assumed before modules so as to be on the low end rather than possible high end).
I thus present to you the Gallente slayer scout:
High modules: 1 Complex shield extender, 1 complex damage mod
Low modules: 3 enhanced armor plates, 1 complex armor repairer
M1 locus grenade
Proto scrambler rifle (because it has highest fitting requirements)
Proto assault SMG (fairly high fitting requirements)
Equipment: 2 compact nanohives
Speed: 500 (sorry not sure how to convert that)
Total shields: 158 HP Total armor: 575 HP
So what we have is a slayer with just a little less HP than an assault, but it is faster and has a smaller hitbox and profile. Can armor repair at 8 HP/sec but can also carry 2 compact hives to self resupply or rep even faster. Not to mention its nice bonus to scanning especially if you have your own passive scan skills increased.
I did not even account for CPU reductions due to weapon skills or PG reductions elsewhere so I'm sure it can be fit better than this even. I'm a ******* when it comes to making fittings so I'm sure someone else can and will fit it much better than this even. |
Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
556
|
Posted - 2014.01.18 02:13:00 -
[3] - Quote
If extra equipment and built in reps are not so great, why are people making such a big deal about the slayer logi? |
Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
556
|
Posted - 2014.01.18 04:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
ALPHA DECRIPTER wrote:What scout would willingly sacrifice THAT MUCH SPEED for HP? Any REAL scout will tell you that our HP is the last thing we look at when trying to make our fits.
2 C-Hives!? What? Are you nuts!? The only scouts that would do something like that are the snipers. The majority of scouts rock RE, Scans, or uplinks so chances are there will be a lot more espionage going on (so much easier to plant RE on tanks when nobody can see you coming). I already enjoy going behind enemy lines and hacking all there stuff right from under there noses so this is gonna make that SOOOOO MUCH EASIER!
Any real logi uses their 5 HP/sec armor rep bonus and PG/CPU to put equipment on their suits and rep, revive, and resupply their squad...and yet.
The fit I threw together was at work with the Dust wiki and the posted suit stats. On top of that I am mediocre at best at putting together fittings the spreadsheet warriors will put together something OP out of this suit. I didn't even think of REs because I'm not a scout and never use the. Hey now scouts can carry twice as many....that'll be great.
Oh hell, I didn't even think of cloak plus REs I play vanilla logi and assault. Now that I have, I think I'm just going to gain passive SP for awhile after 1.8 drops and avoid the annoying RE spam that will soon follow. 2 equipment slot for scout sounds like an even worse idea now. |
Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
557
|
Posted - 2014.01.18 05:59:00 -
[5] - Quote
Denn Maell wrote:If someone wants to be a slayer scout let them. The suit is light and fast, and nigh undetectable. That is its strength. If I were to imagine a 'Slayer Scout' it would be more of a scout dodging around the edge of a battlefield, using his low profile and boosted scan range to dodge around his foes popping into sight from time to time to use alpha damage to wittle down heavies or surprise assaults. Its very tense and exciting.
But sacrificing maneuverability to take a couple of hits in a stand-up fight? Doesn't sound very 'Slayer' if your using a scout suitGǪ
The speed hit will be like 8% ish since armor actually has a stacking bonus so to speak. It'll still be slightly less tanked than assault but still faster than assault not be scanned, but more likely to see you without a scanner, have more equipment, and armor rep more than any other assault on the field and have more versatility. Assault get a 10% fire rate bonus and thus get to reload more.
So I respectfully disagree with those that think ...meh it'll be fine. Hope I'm proven wrong because while scouts needed some love rotating which frames are FotB from medium to other frames is not how one creates balance. I think scouts should lose the 2 equipment slots and have the cloak built in as an ability or have the module fixed on and CPU/PG fixed accordingly if its possible. |
Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
562
|
Posted - 2014.01.18 06:01:00 -
[6] - Quote
Grief PK wrote:To OP: I understand where you are coming from. And it is important to keep in perspective the 'alternative' uses for slots. But the reality is the Proto Gal suit has always had the ability to run load 4 proto plates and run around faster then an assault ... I used to do it all the time, but I still was chewed up by assaults.
The bottom line is that CCP is defining clear paths for us to take advantage of. If ppl use the suit for other edge case scenarios thats fine, but specing a scout suit to play as a second rate assault will always be just that ... a second rate fit.
I can agree with that sentiment...but then I want to keep my 5 HP/sec armor reps and not have to read people whining about slayer logi, they'll just be second rate assaults too |
Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
567
|
Posted - 2014.01.19 17:30:00 -
[7] - Quote
Artificer Ghost wrote:Scouts will be fine.
As someone stated earlier, a suit's bonus is the intended use, not the way a player will use it. Usually, this results in some terribad stuff.
For example: I can have a Megathron (Bonus to Large Blasters Damage & Tracking Speed). I can put Medium Blasters on that Megathron. That's a terrible idea. It might work. But I'm not maximizing the ship's potential, and will sacrifice an entire bonus to have it.
As a Scout, they're going to have a bonus for the Cloaking. This is what's going to happen. People are going to skill into their "Slayer Scout" as you called it, and you know what they're doing? They're giving up a strength in exchange for another strength. And the other strength isn't free. The OTHER strength costs most ISK (4 Complex Plates > 1 Standard Cloak), costs more CPU (4 Complex Plates > 1 Standard Cloak), and costs more SP (Complex Plates > Standard Cloak).
In reality, this entire thing you've built is dumb. I'm sure people going to use the G-Scout WELL, yea, but the downsides outweigh the benefits. They'd be giving up speed, the potential to be invisible, the potential to use better equipment, etc., and all in exchange for the stats of a fully-ADV Gallente Assault suit.
As for your earlier comment about "Why are we crying about the Slayer Logi?", the "Slayers" have MUCH higher CPU/PG, MUCH more slots, and a MUCH more combat-oriented bonus. That's why we're crying about the Slayer Logis.
To everyone reading this and thinking "I can't wait to become a Slayer Scout"... Stop being idiotic. OP's logic is faulty. Realistically, you'd be sacrificing more than you'd be gaining. You'll go 5 into G-Scout, 5 into Armor Plates, 5 into Damage Mods, 5 into Cloaking, 5 in to REs, and 5 into Rail Rifles and you'll suddenly realize that the most useful thing you skilled into was the Rail Rifle, because every other thing suddenly doesn't matter if you got those things to create a role that has not and will not exist.
P.S.: Apparently you weren't here for Beta, OP. The 1.8 Scout is basically the Type-II Scout, but with a Sidearm this time.
/rant over
You may continue drooling to your idea of an OP scout.
That's another thing, by the way, after all the sh*t they've been getting, they deserve to be OP, just for a single patch. I don't think you understand how fast a Scout dies. I've literally been dropped in a single shot before. From a Rail Rifle.
Actually I was here since closed beta, but didn't play scout. Like you said, the type II sacrificed a sidearm. Did it have more CPU and PG than everything but the logi too?
That's fine though, if the assault suits are just like what was posted from singularity without any sort of PG/CPU bonus I'm making my assault suit out of the Gal scout. There are reasons that some Beta vets are clamoring for an assault suit with 2 equipment slots. More equipment and more CPU/PG > 10% RoF |
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